On the newest episode of Pipeline Things Arc 3, Rhett and Chris sit down with Vik Raghavan from Envirocal to discuss their recent innovation, known as The Pig in the Box. They discuss the unique process that Envirocal went through to develop this technology, and it’s the opposite of what you would expect! Beyond the technology, they also discover Vic’s exciting past and his secret skill.
Highlights:
- How can Envirocal run their tools at 75 mph?
- Envirocal’s evolution from gauge plate to caliper tool to the pig in the box that is today
- What is Vic’s secret skill?
- How was Vic able to think outside of the box in order to develop this new technology?
- Combo-tool with IMU, MFL, Caliber, Odometer, and IDOD
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Rhett
All right, on today’s episode, you’re gonna learn a little bit about bags and Chris’s love with them. I don’t mean like bags under your eyes. I mean, Chris is a baggy type guy. Like he likes really high -end bags. No, you don’t wear baggy jeans. Yeah, I know that.
Chris
– You wear some jinkos.
Rhett
– No, like Chris likes to me bags and got real upset with me that I bought a cheap yet highly effective bag with me to PPIM.
Chris
– We’ll see how many lasts.
Rhett
– In between that, you’ll also hear from Vic and EnviroCal, it was a fun episode about how maybe you can find out in EnviroCal Prime and or pig in a bag better known as pig in a box. Thanks for joining us on this episode.
Rhett
Alright we’re on our PPIM 2023 arc welcome to this today’s episode of Pipeline Things. I am your host, Rhett Dotson, my co -host, Christopher De Leon, and you see we have my guest to the right, Vic Raghavan from EnviroCal. We’re gonna be talking to him. But before we do, you know Chris, at these events, I know you’re a big fan of bags, right? Did you get our bags done on time? The branded bags for us?
Chris:
They are ready for pickup, but we’re here. I can’t be in two places at what time.
Rhett
So you didn’t get the bags then? And you’re a big fan of bags, right like you like it to have a certain –
Chris:
Our bag is legit
Rhett
The bag is legit right so you don’t you don’t for you there’s a certain standard you have that you should have and in a bag and the to me is way up here?
Chris
You should find joy when you get your equipment to go to work it’s like a tool bro
Rhett
Being pleasantly surprise it’s like a tool yeah so I just had a conversation with somebody and they were looking at my bag yeah and they’re like this bag is really nice and they’re they’re touching it and they’re like wow you even have like the really cool like electronic charger thing on the side that bag must be really expensive and I’m like Amazon Basics $30 bag
Chris
Knowing you I was gonna say $12
Rhett:
He’s like there’s no way he’s like you got these like you can have it branded now it’s like Christopher won’t let me have it happen because it doesn’t for him it doesn’t
Chris:
There is no swag there’s no swag in that bag . That’s a boring bag.
Rhett
– That bag has a lot packed into it that you wouldn’t have expected. I didn’t even know, but I don’t even use all the stuff.
Chris
– Look.
Rhett
– It’s a well -designed bag.
Chris
Well, we don’t know the quality of it yet. We don’t know if it’s gonna hold up for the conference.
Rhett:
It will hold up for the conference
Chris
– I don’t know. That’s like three days.
Rhett
– And you know what? I had two options, to show up without a bag or show up with a bag.
Chris
– Yeah.
Rhett
– And you didn’t come through with it.
Chris
You have two other bags you could have used from the last two places we’ve been at.
So that’s an excuse, that’s an excuse.
Rhett.
I gave those away. I gave those away I relied on my marketing department.
Chris
– Look, he’s gonna get a bag when whoever wins the raffle also gets their bag. So they’re ready for pickup. I couldn’t send the Holy Spirit to go bring it to me and Amanda’s busy, so.
Rhett
– There you go, so I carry all my stuff in my bag. You know, but the way I’m going with this, you’re probably really wondering where I’m taking the segue.
Chris
– Yeah, you better do a good job at this because it’s so easy for you to go from that to this. –
Rhett
I have not heard.
Chris
– Let’s see your delivery, UPS. Let’s go, UPS.
Rhett
– I’ve not heard of a pig in a bag yet, but I have heard of the pig in the box. And people have been running up to me and asking me about, “Dude, have you ever heard of the pig in the box?” I’m like, “Who is this mysterious pig in the box?”
Chris
– I know about him.
Rhett
– I didn’t know who. I just learned who.
Chris
– Have you been in a box somewhere? How do you not know?
Rhett
– No, but I did not know who the mystery pig in the box person was until you showed me the tool.
—
Rhett
I was, I don’t think I got out enough in the pipeline industry. And when I saw it, I was super impressed. So that brings us to today’s presentation. So, or today’s guest, which is Vic. And so Vic, I wanna lay the background. Our audience has been with us now in a couple of episodes, depending on where we choose to slot this one. And we chose all of the vendors because we hear about different things they’re bringing to the market. Our clients come to us and they’ll ask, have you heard of this company that’s doing that? Have you come to this? And I’ve been hearing now, for probably about the last six months to a year, about this mystery pig in a box. So I just found out who is the pig in the box. And we’re hearing about some of the really cool things that you guys are doing in ViroCal. And I looked for the first time, just put my hands on the tool back there and was immediately impressed at the integration of the sensors. So I was like, oh, this, this is This is cool.
Chris
– It’s clever.
Rhett
– It’s clever. And so that’s the reason we have you on. We hear clients asking us a lot about you. They’re like, “Have y ‘all heard of EnviroCal? “You have any experience running with them?” When we get a lot of questions from our clients, that’s when we know it’s time to go straight to the source. So, Vic, can you introduce us? Tell us a little bit. Who is Vic? Who is EnviroCal? Give the audience an introduction.
Vic
– Certainly. First of all, you guys are good. We’re really good at what you
Rhett
Hey, if you want to come up with pig in a bag if you want to do pig in a bag I just need the credit for it. Okay, and you I can get you a $30 bag to put it
Vic
I see that. You are a bag expert now
Chris
He’s not the guy with the ideas. He is the guy you send to the field
Rhett
There’s some truth to that
Vic
I love it. I love it. How you guys got there. Okay, so Anyway, so Enviro Cal right the Enviro Cal, we got Cal, Caliper, Geometry, all built into it. The original concept was a high resolution, a defamation inspection tool. It was actually a polar opposite of what you know in EnviroCal of today. Now in EnviroCal today’s, we like to think that we’re standing for simplicity. Back then it was about capturing a certain market that was niche such as high speed 30 miles per hour plus pipelines where you don’t have to slow the line down. A more novel approach to speed control where you don’t put a speed control unit rather on the tool at 30 miles 40 miles 50 miles an hour. So that was our first concept.
Chris
I want to pause there just a second because I think this already begins to set the stage of who EnviroCal is right so It wasn’t that it was a pig in a box alone It was you were providing a geometry service that was at high speed
Vick
That is correct
Chris
So that that already kind of sets the brand, right? It’s it’s efficiency convenience and technology
Vic
That is correct. Yes, sir. So the speed control is amazing But we just want her to take a do a different take in a hot speed control Oh, you know what you don’t have necessarily slow everything and just have the tool adaptable to different speeds so you don’t have the fault, you know, failsafe and all that you need to worry about with conventional speed control tools. So there came the idea of a super light, very agile tool, lots of sensors, looks like a spider, requiring very little differential to run through the light. So that was the first concept. We came up with it. W didn’t quite work out because at the time we came out was 2008 and we also missed judged the market. Combo tools were coming out at record pace and the total market cap itself or a product like that or service like that was very very limited not sustainable enough to run you know a business leaving on a build a fleet of tools to capture that the sizes are spread across so and there came a critical juncture where we either had to shut down or do find something else so obviously trying to shoot for the moon and we built everything and the tool is fully ready the recorder was able to record at about 75 miles an hour got everything squared away.
Rhett
Did you have somebody that was willing to run at 75 miles an hour?
Vic
I mean we have ran the top speed we have run is about 35 miles an hour but 70 that I would say everything was set up to do that kind of speed.
Rhett
– The tool actually moving 35 miles per hour?
Vic
– Tools just moving at 35 miles per hour, yes.
Chris
Again, this is why I love the podcast. I bet that 97 % of our listeners, out of 100, maybe three people know that that’s part of y ‘all’s capabilities, at least originally.
Rhett
– I had no idea, I’ve run into challenges with operators wanting to run at that speed and they’ve just been terrified, like well what happens if that little pig runs into, but I But I like you mentioned the weight most people don’t know if you get the weight down you take the energy We’re gonna go way too technical
Vic
No but that’s great. That’s a very good observation It’s the a very good point you know I said it, but you latched on do it see the If you’ve noticed our tools are very light in weight even they are yeah the current tools And that’s because most of our tools are built with aluminum even if you stainless. We are very careful on the what parts, you know, is stainless. Usually they are short and stout.
Rhett
– I just thought you wanted them pretty, ’cause there’s also a very pretty tool. And I was like—
Chris
– Easy to clean off.
Rhett
– Yeah!
Chris
– There’s a rag, it just wipes off.
Rhett
– I mean, when the guy handed me the tool, I thought I was playing with a model. I was like, “It’s a really pretty model.” And he’s like, “No, that’s an actual tool. We’ve run it in a line before.” I was like, “Are you serious?” I kind of wanted to take it with me, but he wouldn’t let me do it. I thought it was a gift, it wasn’t.
Vic
– It’s a hidden benefit. benefit. So that’s where it all started. And then what ended up happening was the business case didn’t make sense. So we had a pretty much in a pivot, pretty hard pivot, and having to try to shoot for the moon, we actually went the other direction. Something super simple, something that’s a need much capital and leverage what we already have. And then So we have Caliper which at that time you know required technicians to run on the market We’re talking 2009 2010.
Chris
Yeah, perfect.
Vic
Yeah combo tools were just introduced just put you back in the timeline and We just wanted to come up with atool that doesn’t require a technician to run, Can run as a replacement for a Caliper in,- you know at a lower level like you know, you got geometry, you’ve got gauge blade, let’s just find something in the middle. Which say gauge blade, you know, whatever price point, at that time geometry was give or take 16 to 20 grand.
We’ll just find something, you know, somewhere in the middle. And so came the idea of this tool. Now what’s cool about that is this tool actually has the guts of the tool that was capable of recording at 75 miles an hour.
Chris
Dude, that’s another quote.
Rhett
I want to send it through a pipe at 74 miles an hour.
Chris
That’s my quote for this day. You’ve got to have the guts to go 75 miles an hour.
Vic
So you see the hidden benefits of it. So one of the things that we were challenged with is who are these guys? Where do they come from? How can we trust them on and on and on?
Rhett
A new player on the market, working in a different sphere that’s not super common, right? Between a gauge blade and a conventional pig. And yeah, it’s an interesting market space you started on.
Vic
So for about, you know, so we’ve been, so the company’s been in existence for 15 to 16 years. The stuff that’s in there, most of the electronics that we have had, most of the stuff that is in the tool was designed by me. And then I’ve never had the chance to actually share this part of the this aspect You know we go to the customer they ask you what’s your success rate? How do you do this? How do you deal with this product? Never had a chance to you know actually explain What’s actually powering the whole system, but that’s it that that level of engineering I come from –
Chris
Vic, vic is powering it.
Rhett
Powered by Vic
Vic
No no no Please That’s not the point I’m trying to make I’m just saying you know so I come from robotics background you know things are a little bit more challenging, a lot of radiation concerns and a lot of reliability concerns. We start off with putting in FPGAs from Xilinx which had you know that was supposed to be for space grade because you know the way I see it a pig is sort of like you know I compare that aviation quite a bit because once you’re up in the air I mean that’s it you don’t get second chances. Yeah. Once it’s in the line. It’s in the line. That’s it.
Chris
Are you enjoying this?
Rhett
No, I actually don’t know if one show is going to be enough. That is honest to God, what is going through my mind right now, because I want to dig in. So you didn’t come from a picking background.
Vic
No, sir.
Rhett
And you designed all the tools?
Vic
The mechanical side of it, you know, there were other people that were involved, you know, throughout the process. So I did, I cannot take it.
Rhett
You bring the ideas to the front, though.
Vic
It’s it’s a very complicated story like you said it can be –
—
Rhett
I guess what I wanted to say is I don’t know it feels maybe a little bit like you weren’t bound to conventional pigging because you didn’t come from a pigging background you knew what the problem is you wanted to solve
Vic
The mechanical engineers so I told you I joined at the company as maybe I didn’t so 2007 I joined as a as just an electrical engineer. The company was in existence. The company was originally founded by Danny Williams who was from Vetco. He is the guy that had all the ideas for the concept. He shared his vision with me. They actually had electrical engineers everything and they already, the company was running at least on a warranty scale, was running. The issue was whatever vision that he had at the time, especially with a high -speed tool, it just was not possible with the resources that he had at disposal. When he shared that idea with me, I just found, okay, then I was able to relate to it and I was able to get it out. But once everything, you know, we were not doing well with the high -resolution, I mean with the high -speed defamation tool, we just, you know, tracked back and when everything started I started playing in a more, you know, involved role because at that point I was more invested. It’s a different topic altogether, but you wanted to, you know, I just wanted to be, wanted to succeed more at this point because I’m committed. And that’s when Itook on an additional role. So, you know, to ask you a question, you may be able to wrap your head around the how electronics and all that from the robotics background, but the the pigging itself. I had no idea. I didn’t know what a pig was. I didn’t know what keeps a pig in the pipeline, what gets it to move in the pipeline. I mean everybody said oh I put a cup, oh it’s going to get it out. It’s not that simple.
Chris
Put a cup on and it’ll come out.
Rhett
I think what I was trying to get to is it feels like you were able to think, this is gonna be a terrible pun. You were able to think outside of the box because I see some of the stuff in your tools.
Chris
BA DUN TSSS
Rhett
But it doesn’t look, yeah I know being right. Edit that out, second string, Sarah, and help us, please. Miss Producer would not approve. It’s, ’cause here’s, I’m gonna take a break, but you said something, and I wanna make sure we pick up it, you said you wanted a tool that had a capability that fit, but that’s not a low -res tool. That’s not a subpar geometry tool that I saw back there. I saw 100% capability, It sounds like it has high speed capabilities. There’s a lot more in that tool than something that fits between a gauge plate and a caliper tool.
Vic
About 12 years has passed since that idea flourished the first time. That’s where the evolution came about.
Rhett
When we come back, we’re going to pick up on that evolution. So if you’re wondering how we get from gauge plate /caliper tool to the pig in the box that is today. You’re going to need to come back after the break and hear from BJ and Ben. Thanks to our sponsors.
PJ Lowe:
PJ Lowe here, Clarion Technical Conferences, and if it’s February, it must be PPIM.
We’re here, that’s right, for the 35th time in Houston, Texas, starting in 1989, and here we are in 2023 with another record -breaking turnout for the world’s largest pipeline technology – related event. We’ve got almost 3 ,500 people coming for four or five days, almost 200 companies exhibiting on the trade show floor, another sellout. It’s not too early to begin thinking about 2024. We sell out around June or July, so clarion.org is where you go to sign up. We hope you can join us for the next conference if you’re not here this year. Another big part of the conference is our training and education program, which takes place on the Monday and Tuesday of the week. And this year we have eight really, really great courses, world -class instructors, and almost 300 people showing up for these specialized courses on different aspects of pipeline integrity technology. I’m here with Ben Stroman, my colleague at Clarion. Hey Ben, what’s up?
Ben
Hey, doing good, always happy to be here because it’s, as we say, PPIM season, it’s February. So I would like to remind everybody that we also have a very specialized technical conference that’s associated with PPIM. And this year I’m proud to say that we have the largest conference program that we’ve ever had, it has 94 technical papers that were chosen from a large selection of submissions that were very high quality so we’re very pleased to be putting on these 94 papers during the week. I’d also like to mention that we do have online training if you aren’t able to make it to PPIM each year. We present online training throughout the year. You can check more of that out at clarion.org and we hope to see you in one way or another online or in person and if you’re not here at the 35th version of PPIM I hope you’re here at the 36th.
PJ
definitely.
Rhett
All right welcome back to the PPIM 23 our technology arc where we are sitting here with Vic from EnviroCal and if you were in the first break And if you’re not a YouTube watcher you might want to get back on to the YouTube channel because they get so excited He came back with a tool an actual tool.
Chris
It’s exactly their model. That’s how convenient it is So if you if you can’t tell like I’m there’s a tool on the table I’m drinking like my cup of water and oh look at look at that—
Rhett
Chris might be short, but this tool is real size Let’s be real. So it’s kind of funny Okay, this kind of just speaks to honestly in my opinion how how unique you guys are I picked this up at you guys booth and I was like that’s such a cool model I was like do y ‘all give these out it’s like it’s not a model man it’s an actual tool like that things run in the line and it’s fabulous so this is like this is in EnviroCal.
Chris
that’s it man
Rhett
Tis the pig in a box we can put it in a box and demonstrate there’s got box down there we can put it in so
Vic
Yeah of course The pig in a box. It comes from the fact that, you know, we are shipping the tool to the customers and they can learn, you know, what the help from us but not being on site.
Rhett
That’s amazing. But that’s not all you guys do today, right? So again, I want to go back where we left off before the break. So if you’re on the YouTube, you need to jump onto the YouTube channel and catch the actual tool. It’s pretty nifty. That’s a three inch? That’s a three inch tool?
Vic
Yeah.
Rhett
But that’s not where you guys are at today. Y ‘all are doing more than just depth. So take us to where is EnviroCal today? And what are you guys doing on the market? What’s different?
Vic
Okay, so considering where we started, the evolution, and then we latched on to the different market segments over the years, what we have learned is this concept can be taken beyond caliber.
Rhett
This concept, you mean like this condensed, highly efficient concept?
Vic
Yes.
Rhett
Okay.
Vic
So, to give you perspective, so this technology is about, since we had our hands on it about 12, 13 years ago, a lot of things have changed over the years and we wanted to focus in and apply this model, apply the technology into something a little bit more advanced and that came that led us to the path of you know pursuing an MFL tool. We did a little bit of you know market research and we discovered you know where the industry is going you know which is towards triaxial sensors, high density you know sensor packing etc. A conventional MFL tool, combo tool which has multiple sections. We have a hard time graphing our head around how we could make that tool fit our model. We still would like to put it in a box, we still would like to ship it to customers and we would like to provide them more support and let them deal with it and we’ll help them deal with it. And that came, That pushed us towards having tofigure something out where all of the sensors that typically go on a triple combo tool, basic MFL triple combo, in one session. That’s where we are today, and we have been working on it for about four years at this point. And we have done a couple of test runs. We have learned that we still have a little bit more work to do. Packing everything in such a small space now requires a little bit more worth than I would be anticipated but we’re there, we’re almost there. We’ve had some successful…
Chris
So it lets you engineer and architect basically, right?
Vic
You know you could that’s a once you’re one kind of an engineer, you’re all kinds of engineers, I mean there’s no limit, especially pipelines have taught me that, is your job cannot be confined to one thing.
Rhett
So I want to dig in a little bit, I’m curious just how in the back room this happens. So one of the things I really like about y’alls, I think it’s a six inch tool you had over there, is I love how you had the geometry sensors combined with the MFL, the triaxial sensor sitting on the head of the geometry, and I was like oh that’s a fabulous as you mentioned like condensing it down right yes whose idea was that? how does that come out we all sitting around the table and you’re like hey how do we do this or somebody’s like you know I’ve always wanted to do this what what does it look like there’s a customer give you that idea y ‘all organically driven?
Vic
So we drew a box you know we know I mean –
Chris
It has got to fit in the box –
Rhett
So you start with the box
Vic
Okay he goes to get the box put it on the table it’s gotta fit in here
Vic
It’s not like a red bag I didn’t start with a bag, rather it was more at a figure of speech, let’s just say a bar napkin we drew a box, just through a box, a tangler box, or a square box, and then we said this is what has to be done, and our objective was to take this MFL tool to a single section as quickly as possible.
Chris
So for those of you that are thinking about it, So your typical combo tool, not all combo tools,
Rhett
Multiple trains.
Chris
– It’s multiple vehicles in the train. So think of a real train, right? You might have an electronics package on the front, or some technology, then the caliper unit, then the FL unit, maybe more electronics with odometers. What he’s saying is gotta bring all that into one body. And so if you think about it, is it’s you need square inches, you need space, right? To condense everything into the electronics, storage, power, the sensor package, all of that odometers, all of that on the one vehicle. And then you gotta put it in a box. And then you gotta make it efficient enough to where the operator can handle it and know how to use it.
Vic
It has to be rugged enough, yes. Going back to the sensors first, the problem is the physics don’t help you there. The most common way to detect defamation is using a magnetic field, a couple of magnets, two, three, a magnet area of some sort, and find the deflection. Now, you combine that field with the main field of the magnetization system. They interact. You take the IDOD, for example, that’s sitting on top of, it has to sit on top of the sensor head. And you have sensor head, IDOD, coil, and then below that you have the MFL sensors. The MFL is your bread and butter. You want that to be as efficient as possible but now the IDOD becomes an afterthought no matter what you do and as luck would have it the IDOD is closer to the MFL sensors that the board up there than it is to the pipe so those are the physical challenges that we had to overcome or and we did there’s still you know some things some kink that we got to figure out.
Chris
Normal
Vic
Yeah, and then we just took it, we did unit testing on each one of them and we combined them together and just made sure they all worked and then we went into the, start putting it on the tool.
Chris
So, if I can, would you, where are you guys in this phase, right? Are you all still in R &D? Are you all in the commercialization phase? Just high level, where are you guys at right now with this tool?
Vic
So, in a non -pressure environment, we have done several pools and we have verified the data, we’ve alsodone some sizing models and they all are within the specifications. The pressure environment, so far our electronics has been able to handle about 500PSI or so work because of the space for the cap for the electronics housing, we still have a little bit more work to do to make it all fit in. So we
Rhett
You’re. talking about functional limitations, run limitations, so pressure, things like that,got it.
—
Vic
The physics aspect of it, or the concept itself, has been proven. It’s done.
Chris
So we can say you have a combotool, and I’m going to go on a big stretch here, right? Because I want you guys to appreciate what we’re talking about. You have IMU?
Vic
Yes.
Chris
MFL
Vic
Yep.
Chris
Caliper
Vic
Yep.
Chris
Or deformation? That’s correct.
Vic
Yes.
Chris
And odometer?
Vic
Yep.
Chris
All of that?
Vic
And IDOD?
Chris
In IDOD, it is in a box now, and it’s functional.
Vic
Yeah, that’s right.
Chris
Wow. That’s awesome.
Rhett
You shipping via FedEx, UPS. What is it? The orange truck? Pansky? Where we go?
Chris
So, that’s a trade secret. Hey, don’t give that out.
Vic
Can’t give that out, guys.
Chris
Don’t give that out.
Rhett
Is it like two day, if you Is it like today if you sign up for —
Vic
Prime
Rhett
Yeah, there you go. I was gonna get in EnviroCal Prime you get free two day shipping
—-
Rhett
I have given you two ideas now and EnviroCal Prime and Pig in a bag if you use either one, I just need you to give me a shout out.
Vic
I have to put your name on it and I think prime’s too old. I gotta we gotta come up with more creative
Rhett
Yeah, and EnviroCal Prime, oh my gosh.
Chris
This is really good.
Rhett
It’s amazing, so in the last bit of time we have left, and I’ve really enjoyed speaking with you today. You have a lot of energy, it’s so cool to hear the ideas and how you guys are manifesting them. And again, I really like thinking differently, right? Like taking it modular, simplifying it. ‘Cause you know, I had lots of conversations. Two things you’ve hit on that have been problematic for companies with me. One is speed? Speed is, I’m so curious if you’re all still willing to run your modular technology at 30 or 40 miles an hour.
Vic
I mean the MFL has physical limitations,
Rhett
That’s true, but the Cal, the DEF IMU doesn’t.
Vic
Yeah, it doesn’t. And the sampling rates are high enough, it’s just a matter of making sure the tool would stand and the time constant on the springs not handle it. I mean, there’s definitely more wear and tear on the tools as you run faster.
Rhett
But But I’ve hit on that –
Chirs
Speed isn’t gonna be that big of an issue.
Rhett
No, it is for some people though that it is for some people that need to run Repeatable inspections after certain threats. There’s a there’s a market for that And then the second thing is the operators being able to run it.So I’ve heard a lot of operators complain like hey Look if you want to run a tool, it’s expensive We got to get the whole cruise out there and you’re you’re chipping away at that which is in it in a way that is efficient like not not chipping away on key things but you can give the operator the ability to take your tool put it in the pipe themselves I mean that’s –
Chris
Efficient
Rhett
it’s just efficient it’s good I really like what I’m hearing where are you guys going now what’s on the forefront
Vic
so the you know getting the MFL commercialized I think this is gonna be a very big thing so some of the reasons so you asked why we put you know what’s the idea behind the MFL to The MFL tool, obviously, the obvious being an extension to what we’re doing, the other important thing is by shrinking it, for our benefit is one, but you’ve got to look at it from a customer’s perspective. You don’t need to do any more trap modifications.
Rhett
Oh, yes.
Chris
And that’s something in itself as well, right?
Rhett
I know. This is… Yeah.
Chris
It’s fantastic.
Vic
And then from 12 -inch and now we’re shooting for a single section. So…
Rhett
A – 12 inch tool, single body.
Vic
Single body 12 inch. So.
Chris
So for others, what that means is that 12 inch up, it would ideally be single body in many cases. Yeah, it’s fantastic.
Vic
Yes, we’re at this point in time we’re only planning to go up to 12.
Chris
Okay.
Rhett
Oh, I was going to ask if we’re going to come up with like a 48 inch tool and then it’s going to be a 48 single body.
Chris
I’m going to change direction a little bit. So talk to us a little bit and we appreciate you. We’ll keep you here all day if we don’t stop at some point. Are you guys manufacturing these tools? Are y ‘all building your own tools or are you outsourcing that?
Vic
No, we are. We build our tools. We design. Everything is done in -house.
Chris
So that means if you’re an operator and you need something, you’re able to take care of them?
Vic
Absolutely. Yes, sir. Yes. This tool is funny. This tool was not a tool that—
Rhett
Was built right for the show? Im just kidding
Vic
Yes, you know, not our show, not our kind of show, it’s kind of show. I mean, the customer called and said they wanted it too. I mean, we have, you wouldn’t believe it, that the crisis creates so many opportunities to come up with something new.
You know, without naming, you know, people, but you know, you run a four inch line and you realize they have a miter in the four inch. What are you gonna do? Build a three inch, put a four inch gap. And it’s a non -stop process.
Chris
Don’t let a good crisis go to waste. Yeah, exactly. It’s an opportunity.
Rhett
You’re so political.
Vic
I’m speaking from an engineering passion’s standpoint.
Chris
We need to cut this off.
Vic
I’m just messing with you guys, but seriously, that’s how we have been able to come up with with new tools with with cutting edge, you know, out -of -the -box tools every single time because a certain pipeline would give you that challenge to, the motivation to go figure it out.
Rhett
Vic, you bring so much passion to the table. This has been a lot of fun. So if you’re one of our guests, one of our listeners, you really need to give EnviroCal a look, go see their booth, check out the pig in the box. Maybe one day you sign up for EnviroCal Prime. Thank you, Rhett. We’ll see, but hey, before we let our listeners go, you’re so passionate about tools. What do you do when you’re not building tools?
Vic
– I, uh -huh.
Rhett
Don’t tell me all you do is build tools.
Vic
I like to fly.
Rhett
You’re a pilot?
Vic
Yes, sir. Yes.
Rhett
Oh, fantastic. So, hence the, the you said earlier that there’s a lot of similarities between…
Vic
Everything is interconnected in some fashion.
Rhett
Yeah. How long did you pilot’s license?
Vic
About four years now.
Rhett
Oh, fantastic.
Chris
And, and you, we’re working on MFL to all at the same time. That’s awesome.
Vic
It’s all part of the plan, though.
Rhett
So you’re going to fly over the lines too and do right -of -way inspections?
Vic
I can test the shipping methodology myself.
Rhett
Are you just going to drop it off? It’s like a parachute. Do you just drop it off and it parachutes down?
Vic
Actually, my plane is actually SR -22. It does have a parachute, by the way, for the entire airframe.
Chris
So my wife doesn’t know that. I’ve talked to my wife multiple times. I’ve mentioned it. So we live by Hooks Airport in Alright, and we drive by it all the time and I legit tomorrow if I was like, you know, maybe a lot of these planes are cheaper than Mercedes So I think we need to buy a plane and she doesn’t even answer anymore. She just keeps on like, you know, they have a parachute, right? I’ll give you another you know her uncle Had one of those and it about three years ago it parachuted into someone’s front lawn if you Google that in Houston That was the her uncle. But anyways,
Vic
Yeah, they work great, you know, You know, I
Rhett
You’ve tested a parachute. Nope. This is where we have to wrap it up I may need a partner at some point in time if he learns how to start flying because if he flies like he drives I am definitely in trouble. Vic I want to thank you for joining us to all of our guests. Hopefully you enjoyed it and we have See you again. Hopefully next year’s PPIM and thanks for joining us
All right, on today’s episode, you’re gonna learn a little bit about bags and Chris’s love with them. I don’t mean like bags under your eyes. I mean, Chris is a baggy type guy. Like he likes really high -end bags. No, you don’t wear baggy jeans. Yeah, I know that.
Chris
– You wear some jinkos.
Rhett
– No, like Chris likes to me bags and got real upset with me that I bought a cheap yet highly effective bag with me to PPIM.
Chris
– We’ll see how many lasts.
Rhett
– In between that, you’ll also hear from Vic and EnviroCal, it was a fun episode about how maybe you can find out in EnviroCal Prime and or pig in a bag better known as pig in a box. Thanks for joining us on this episode.
Rhett
Alright we’re on our PPIM 2023 arc welcome to this today’s episode of Pipeline Things. I am your host, Rhett Dotson, my co -host, Christopher De Leon, and you see we have my guest to the right, Vic Raghavan from EnviroCal. We’re gonna be talking to him. But before we do, you know Chris, at these events, I know you’re a big fan of bags, right? Did you get our bags done on time? The branded bags for us?
Chris:
They are ready for pickup, but we’re here. I can’t be in two places at what time.
Rhett
So you didn’t get the bags then? And you’re a big fan of bags, right like you like it to have a certain –
Chris:
Our bag is legit
Rhett
The bag is legit right so you don’t you don’t for you there’s a certain standard you have that you should have and in a bag and the to me is way up here?
Chris
You should find joy when you get your equipment to go to work it’s like a tool bro
Rhett
Being pleasantly surprise it’s like a tool yeah so I just had a conversation with somebody and they were looking at my bag yeah and they’re like this bag is really nice and they’re they’re touching it and they’re like wow you even have like the really cool like electronic charger thing on the side that bag must be really expensive and I’m like Amazon Basics $30 bag
Chris
Knowing you I was gonna say $12
Rhett:
He’s like there’s no way he’s like you got these like you can have it branded now it’s like Christopher won’t let me have it happen because it doesn’t for him it doesn’t
Chris:
There is no swag there’s no swag in that bag . That’s a boring bag.
Rhett
– That bag has a lot packed into it that you wouldn’t have expected. I didn’t even know, but I don’t even use all the stuff.
Chris
– Look.
Rhett
– It’s a well -designed bag.
Chris
Well, we don’t know the quality of it yet. We don’t know if it’s gonna hold up for the conference.
Rhett:
It will hold up for the conference
Chris
– I don’t know. That’s like three days.
Rhett
– And you know what? I had two options, to show up without a bag or show up with a bag.
Chris
– Yeah.
Rhett
– And you didn’t come through with it.
Chris
You have two other bags you could have used from the last two places we’ve been at.
So that’s an excuse, that’s an excuse.
Rhett.
I gave those away. I gave those away I relied on my marketing department.
Chris
– Look, he’s gonna get a bag when whoever wins the raffle also gets their bag. So they’re ready for pickup. I couldn’t send the Holy Spirit to go bring it to me and Amanda’s busy, so.
Rhett
– There you go, so I carry all my stuff in my bag. You know, but the way I’m going with this, you’re probably really wondering where I’m taking the segue.
Chris
– Yeah, you better do a good job at this because it’s so easy for you to go from that to this. –
Rhett
I have not heard.
Chris
– Let’s see your delivery, UPS. Let’s go, UPS.
Rhett
– I’ve not heard of a pig in a bag yet, but I have heard of the pig in the box. And people have been running up to me and asking me about, “Dude, have you ever heard of the pig in the box?” I’m like, “Who is this mysterious pig in the box?”
Chris
– I know about him.
Rhett
– I didn’t know who. I just learned who.
Chris
– Have you been in a box somewhere? How do you not know?
Rhett
– No, but I did not know who the mystery pig in the box person was until you showed me the tool.
—
Rhett
I was, I don’t think I got out enough in the pipeline industry. And when I saw it, I was super impressed. So that brings us to today’s presentation. So, or today’s guest, which is Vic. And so Vic, I wanna lay the background. Our audience has been with us now in a couple of episodes, depending on where we choose to slot this one. And we chose all of the vendors because we hear about different things they’re bringing to the market. Our clients come to us and they’ll ask, have you heard of this company that’s doing that? Have you come to this? And I’ve been hearing now, for probably about the last six months to a year, about this mystery pig in a box. So I just found out who is the pig in the box. And we’re hearing about some of the really cool things that you guys are doing in ViroCal. And I looked for the first time, just put my hands on the tool back there and was immediately impressed at the integration of the sensors. So I was like, oh, this, this is This is cool.
Chris
– It’s clever.
Rhett
– It’s clever. And so that’s the reason we have you on. We hear clients asking us a lot about you. They’re like, “Have y ‘all heard of EnviroCal? “You have any experience running with them?” When we get a lot of questions from our clients, that’s when we know it’s time to go straight to the source. So, Vic, can you introduce us? Tell us a little bit. Who is Vic? Who is EnviroCal? Give the audience an introduction.
Vic
– Certainly. First of all, you guys are good. We’re really good at what you
Rhett
Hey, if you want to come up with pig in a bag if you want to do pig in a bag I just need the credit for it. Okay, and you I can get you a $30 bag to put it
Vic
I see that. You are a bag expert now
Chris
He’s not the guy with the ideas. He is the guy you send to the field
Rhett
There’s some truth to that
Vic
I love it. I love it. How you guys got there. Okay, so Anyway, so Enviro Cal right the Enviro Cal, we got Cal, Caliper, Geometry, all built into it. The original concept was a high resolution, a defamation inspection tool. It was actually a polar opposite of what you know in EnviroCal of today. Now in EnviroCal today’s, we like to think that we’re standing for simplicity. Back then it was about capturing a certain market that was niche such as high speed 30 miles per hour plus pipelines where you don’t have to slow the line down. A more novel approach to speed control where you don’t put a speed control unit rather on the tool at 30 miles 40 miles 50 miles an hour. So that was our first concept.
Chris
I want to pause there just a second because I think this already begins to set the stage of who EnviroCal is right so It wasn’t that it was a pig in a box alone It was you were providing a geometry service that was at high speed
Vick
That is correct
Chris
So that that already kind of sets the brand, right? It’s it’s efficiency convenience and technology
Vic
That is correct. Yes, sir. So the speed control is amazing But we just want her to take a do a different take in a hot speed control Oh, you know what you don’t have necessarily slow everything and just have the tool adaptable to different speeds so you don’t have the fault, you know, failsafe and all that you need to worry about with conventional speed control tools. So there came the idea of a super light, very agile tool, lots of sensors, looks like a spider, requiring very little differential to run through the light. So that was the first concept. We came up with it. W didn’t quite work out because at the time we came out was 2008 and we also missed judged the market. Combo tools were coming out at record pace and the total market cap itself or a product like that or service like that was very very limited not sustainable enough to run you know a business leaving on a build a fleet of tools to capture that the sizes are spread across so and there came a critical juncture where we either had to shut down or do find something else so obviously trying to shoot for the moon and we built everything and the tool is fully ready the recorder was able to record at about 75 miles an hour got everything squared away.
Rhett
Did you have somebody that was willing to run at 75 miles an hour?
Vic
I mean we have ran the top speed we have run is about 35 miles an hour but 70 that I would say everything was set up to do that kind of speed.
Rhett
– The tool actually moving 35 miles per hour?
Vic
– Tools just moving at 35 miles per hour, yes.
Chris
Again, this is why I love the podcast. I bet that 97 % of our listeners, out of 100, maybe three people know that that’s part of y ‘all’s capabilities, at least originally.
Rhett
– I had no idea, I’ve run into challenges with operators wanting to run at that speed and they’ve just been terrified, like well what happens if that little pig runs into, but I But I like you mentioned the weight most people don’t know if you get the weight down you take the energy We’re gonna go way too technical
Vic
No but that’s great. That’s a very good observation It’s the a very good point you know I said it, but you latched on do it see the If you’ve noticed our tools are very light in weight even they are yeah the current tools And that’s because most of our tools are built with aluminum even if you stainless. We are very careful on the what parts, you know, is stainless. Usually they are short and stout.
Rhett
– I just thought you wanted them pretty, ’cause there’s also a very pretty tool. And I was like—
Chris
– Easy to clean off.
Rhett
– Yeah!
Chris
– There’s a rag, it just wipes off.
Rhett
– I mean, when the guy handed me the tool, I thought I was playing with a model. I was like, “It’s a really pretty model.” And he’s like, “No, that’s an actual tool. We’ve run it in a line before.” I was like, “Are you serious?” I kind of wanted to take it with me, but he wouldn’t let me do it. I thought it was a gift, it wasn’t.
Vic
– It’s a hidden benefit. benefit. So that’s where it all started. And then what ended up happening was the business case didn’t make sense. So we had a pretty much in a pivot, pretty hard pivot, and having to try to shoot for the moon, we actually went the other direction. Something super simple, something that’s a need much capital and leverage what we already have. And then So we have Caliper which at that time you know required technicians to run on the market We’re talking 2009 2010.
Chris
Yeah, perfect.
Vic
Yeah combo tools were just introduced just put you back in the timeline and We just wanted to come up with atool that doesn’t require a technician to run, Can run as a replacement for a Caliper in,- you know at a lower level like you know, you got geometry, you’ve got gauge blade, let’s just find something in the middle. Which say gauge blade, you know, whatever price point, at that time geometry was give or take 16 to 20 grand.
We’ll just find something, you know, somewhere in the middle. And so came the idea of this tool. Now what’s cool about that is this tool actually has the guts of the tool that was capable of recording at 75 miles an hour.
Chris
Dude, that’s another quote.
Rhett
I want to send it through a pipe at 74 miles an hour.
Chris
That’s my quote for this day. You’ve got to have the guts to go 75 miles an hour.
Vic
So you see the hidden benefits of it. So one of the things that we were challenged with is who are these guys? Where do they come from? How can we trust them on and on and on?
Rhett
A new player on the market, working in a different sphere that’s not super common, right? Between a gauge blade and a conventional pig. And yeah, it’s an interesting market space you started on.
Vic
So for about, you know, so we’ve been, so the company’s been in existence for 15 to 16 years. The stuff that’s in there, most of the electronics that we have had, most of the stuff that is in the tool was designed by me. And then I’ve never had the chance to actually share this part of the this aspect You know we go to the customer they ask you what’s your success rate? How do you do this? How do you deal with this product? Never had a chance to you know actually explain What’s actually powering the whole system, but that’s it that that level of engineering I come from –
Chris
Vic, vic is powering it.
Rhett
Powered by Vic
Vic
No no no Please That’s not the point I’m trying to make I’m just saying you know so I come from robotics background you know things are a little bit more challenging, a lot of radiation concerns and a lot of reliability concerns. We start off with putting in FPGAs from Xilinx which had you know that was supposed to be for space grade because you know the way I see it a pig is sort of like you know I compare that aviation quite a bit because once you’re up in the air I mean that’s it you don’t get second chances. Yeah. Once it’s in the line. It’s in the line. That’s it.
Chris
Are you enjoying this?
Rhett
No, I actually don’t know if one show is going to be enough. That is honest to God, what is going through my mind right now, because I want to dig in. So you didn’t come from a picking background.
Vic
No, sir.
Rhett
And you designed all the tools?
Vic
The mechanical side of it, you know, there were other people that were involved, you know, throughout the process. So I did, I cannot take it.
Rhett
You bring the ideas to the front, though.
Vic
It’s it’s a very complicated story like you said it can be –
—
Rhett
I guess what I wanted to say is I don’t know it feels maybe a little bit like you weren’t bound to conventional pigging because you didn’t come from a pigging background you knew what the problem is you wanted to solve
Vic
The mechanical engineers so I told you I joined at the company as maybe I didn’t so 2007 I joined as a as just an electrical engineer. The company was in existence. The company was originally founded by Danny Williams who was from Vetco. He is the guy that had all the ideas for the concept. He shared his vision with me. They actually had electrical engineers everything and they already, the company was running at least on a warranty scale, was running. The issue was whatever vision that he had at the time, especially with a high -speed tool, it just was not possible with the resources that he had at disposal. When he shared that idea with me, I just found, okay, then I was able to relate to it and I was able to get it out. But once everything, you know, we were not doing well with the high -resolution, I mean with the high -speed defamation tool, we just, you know, tracked back and when everything started I started playing in a more, you know, involved role because at that point I was more invested. It’s a different topic altogether, but you wanted to, you know, I just wanted to be, wanted to succeed more at this point because I’m committed. And that’s when Itook on an additional role. So, you know, to ask you a question, you may be able to wrap your head around the how electronics and all that from the robotics background, but the the pigging itself. I had no idea. I didn’t know what a pig was. I didn’t know what keeps a pig in the pipeline, what gets it to move in the pipeline. I mean everybody said oh I put a cup, oh it’s going to get it out. It’s not that simple.
Chris
Put a cup on and it’ll come out.
Rhett
I think what I was trying to get to is it feels like you were able to think, this is gonna be a terrible pun. You were able to think outside of the box because I see some of the stuff in your tools.
Chris
BA DUN TSSS
Rhett
But it doesn’t look, yeah I know being right. Edit that out, second string, Sarah, and help us, please. Miss Producer would not approve. It’s, ’cause here’s, I’m gonna take a break, but you said something, and I wanna make sure we pick up it, you said you wanted a tool that had a capability that fit, but that’s not a low -res tool. That’s not a subpar geometry tool that I saw back there. I saw 100% capability, It sounds like it has high speed capabilities. There’s a lot more in that tool than something that fits between a gauge plate and a caliper tool.
Vic
About 12 years has passed since that idea flourished the first time. That’s where the evolution came about.
Rhett
When we come back, we’re going to pick up on that evolution. So if you’re wondering how we get from gauge plate /caliper tool to the pig in the box that is today. You’re going to need to come back after the break and hear from BJ and Ben. Thanks to our sponsors.
PJ Lowe:
PJ Lowe here, Clarion Technical Conferences, and if it’s February, it must be PPIM.
We’re here, that’s right, for the 35th time in Houston, Texas, starting in 1989, and here we are in 2023 with another record -breaking turnout for the world’s largest pipeline technology – related event. We’ve got almost 3 ,500 people coming for four or five days, almost 200 companies exhibiting on the trade show floor, another sellout. It’s not too early to begin thinking about 2024. We sell out around June or July, so clarion.org is where you go to sign up. We hope you can join us for the next conference if you’re not here this year. Another big part of the conference is our training and education program, which takes place on the Monday and Tuesday of the week. And this year we have eight really, really great courses, world -class instructors, and almost 300 people showing up for these specialized courses on different aspects of pipeline integrity technology. I’m here with Ben Stroman, my colleague at Clarion. Hey Ben, what’s up?
Ben
Hey, doing good, always happy to be here because it’s, as we say, PPIM season, it’s February. So I would like to remind everybody that we also have a very specialized technical conference that’s associated with PPIM. And this year I’m proud to say that we have the largest conference program that we’ve ever had, it has 94 technical papers that were chosen from a large selection of submissions that were very high quality so we’re very pleased to be putting on these 94 papers during the week. I’d also like to mention that we do have online training if you aren’t able to make it to PPIM each year. We present online training throughout the year. You can check more of that out at clarion.org and we hope to see you in one way or another online or in person and if you’re not here at the 35th version of PPIM I hope you’re here at the 36th.
PJ
definitely.
Rhett
All right welcome back to the PPIM 23 our technology arc where we are sitting here with Vic from EnviroCal and if you were in the first break And if you’re not a YouTube watcher you might want to get back on to the YouTube channel because they get so excited He came back with a tool an actual tool.
Chris
It’s exactly their model. That’s how convenient it is So if you if you can’t tell like I’m there’s a tool on the table I’m drinking like my cup of water and oh look at look at that—
Rhett
Chris might be short, but this tool is real size Let’s be real. So it’s kind of funny Okay, this kind of just speaks to honestly in my opinion how how unique you guys are I picked this up at you guys booth and I was like that’s such a cool model I was like do y ‘all give these out it’s like it’s not a model man it’s an actual tool like that things run in the line and it’s fabulous so this is like this is in EnviroCal.
Chris
that’s it man
Rhett
Tis the pig in a box we can put it in a box and demonstrate there’s got box down there we can put it in so
Vic
Yeah of course The pig in a box. It comes from the fact that, you know, we are shipping the tool to the customers and they can learn, you know, what the help from us but not being on site.
Rhett
That’s amazing. But that’s not all you guys do today, right? So again, I want to go back where we left off before the break. So if you’re on the YouTube, you need to jump onto the YouTube channel and catch the actual tool. It’s pretty nifty. That’s a three inch? That’s a three inch tool?
Vic
Yeah.
Rhett
But that’s not where you guys are at today. Y ‘all are doing more than just depth. So take us to where is EnviroCal today? And what are you guys doing on the market? What’s different?
Vic
Okay, so considering where we started, the evolution, and then we latched on to the different market segments over the years, what we have learned is this concept can be taken beyond caliber.
Rhett
This concept, you mean like this condensed, highly efficient concept?
Vic
Yes.
Rhett
Okay.
Vic
So, to give you perspective, so this technology is about, since we had our hands on it about 12, 13 years ago, a lot of things have changed over the years and we wanted to focus in and apply this model, apply the technology into something a little bit more advanced and that came that led us to the path of you know pursuing an MFL tool. We did a little bit of you know market research and we discovered you know where the industry is going you know which is towards triaxial sensors, high density you know sensor packing etc. A conventional MFL tool, combo tool which has multiple sections. We have a hard time graphing our head around how we could make that tool fit our model. We still would like to put it in a box, we still would like to ship it to customers and we would like to provide them more support and let them deal with it and we’ll help them deal with it. And that came, That pushed us towards having tofigure something out where all of the sensors that typically go on a triple combo tool, basic MFL triple combo, in one session. That’s where we are today, and we have been working on it for about four years at this point. And we have done a couple of test runs. We have learned that we still have a little bit more work to do. Packing everything in such a small space now requires a little bit more worth than I would be anticipated but we’re there, we’re almost there. We’ve had some successful…
Chris
So it lets you engineer and architect basically, right?
Vic
You know you could that’s a once you’re one kind of an engineer, you’re all kinds of engineers, I mean there’s no limit, especially pipelines have taught me that, is your job cannot be confined to one thing.
Rhett
So I want to dig in a little bit, I’m curious just how in the back room this happens. So one of the things I really like about y’alls, I think it’s a six inch tool you had over there, is I love how you had the geometry sensors combined with the MFL, the triaxial sensor sitting on the head of the geometry, and I was like oh that’s a fabulous as you mentioned like condensing it down right yes whose idea was that? how does that come out we all sitting around the table and you’re like hey how do we do this or somebody’s like you know I’ve always wanted to do this what what does it look like there’s a customer give you that idea y ‘all organically driven?
Vic
So we drew a box you know we know I mean –
Chris
It has got to fit in the box –
Rhett
So you start with the box
Vic
Okay he goes to get the box put it on the table it’s gotta fit in here
Vic
It’s not like a red bag I didn’t start with a bag, rather it was more at a figure of speech, let’s just say a bar napkin we drew a box, just through a box, a tangler box, or a square box, and then we said this is what has to be done, and our objective was to take this MFL tool to a single section as quickly as possible.
Chris
So for those of you that are thinking about it, So your typical combo tool, not all combo tools,
Rhett
Multiple trains.
Chris
– It’s multiple vehicles in the train. So think of a real train, right? You might have an electronics package on the front, or some technology, then the caliper unit, then the FL unit, maybe more electronics with odometers. What he’s saying is gotta bring all that into one body. And so if you think about it, is it’s you need square inches, you need space, right? To condense everything into the electronics, storage, power, the sensor package, all of that odometers, all of that on the one vehicle. And then you gotta put it in a box. And then you gotta make it efficient enough to where the operator can handle it and know how to use it.
Vic
It has to be rugged enough, yes. Going back to the sensors first, the problem is the physics don’t help you there. The most common way to detect defamation is using a magnetic field, a couple of magnets, two, three, a magnet area of some sort, and find the deflection. Now, you combine that field with the main field of the magnetization system. They interact. You take the IDOD, for example, that’s sitting on top of, it has to sit on top of the sensor head. And you have sensor head, IDOD, coil, and then below that you have the MFL sensors. The MFL is your bread and butter. You want that to be as efficient as possible but now the IDOD becomes an afterthought no matter what you do and as luck would have it the IDOD is closer to the MFL sensors that the board up there than it is to the pipe so those are the physical challenges that we had to overcome or and we did there’s still you know some things some kink that we got to figure out.
Chris
Normal
Vic
Yeah, and then we just took it, we did unit testing on each one of them and we combined them together and just made sure they all worked and then we went into the, start putting it on the tool.
Chris
So, if I can, would you, where are you guys in this phase, right? Are you all still in R &D? Are you all in the commercialization phase? Just high level, where are you guys at right now with this tool?
Vic
So, in a non -pressure environment, we have done several pools and we have verified the data, we’ve alsodone some sizing models and they all are within the specifications. The pressure environment, so far our electronics has been able to handle about 500PSI or so work because of the space for the cap for the electronics housing, we still have a little bit more work to do to make it all fit in. So we
Rhett
You’re. talking about functional limitations, run limitations, so pressure, things like that,got it.
—
Vic
The physics aspect of it, or the concept itself, has been proven. It’s done.
Chris
So we can say you have a combotool, and I’m going to go on a big stretch here, right? Because I want you guys to appreciate what we’re talking about. You have IMU?
Vic
Yes.
Chris
MFL
Vic
Yep.
Chris
Caliper
Vic
Yep.
Chris
Or deformation? That’s correct.
Vic
Yes.
Chris
And odometer?
Vic
Yep.
Chris
All of that?
Vic
And IDOD?
Chris
In IDOD, it is in a box now, and it’s functional.
Vic
Yeah, that’s right.
Chris
Wow. That’s awesome.
Rhett
You shipping via FedEx, UPS. What is it? The orange truck? Pansky? Where we go?
Chris
So, that’s a trade secret. Hey, don’t give that out.
Vic
Can’t give that out, guys.
Chris
Don’t give that out.
Rhett
Is it like two day, if you Is it like today if you sign up for —
Vic
Prime
Rhett
Yeah, there you go. I was gonna get in EnviroCal Prime you get free two day shipping
—-
Rhett
I have given you two ideas now and EnviroCal Prime and Pig in a bag if you use either one, I just need you to give me a shout out.
Vic
I have to put your name on it and I think prime’s too old. I gotta we gotta come up with more creative
Rhett
Yeah, and EnviroCal Prime, oh my gosh.
Chris
This is really good.
Rhett
It’s amazing, so in the last bit of time we have left, and I’ve really enjoyed speaking with you today. You have a lot of energy, it’s so cool to hear the ideas and how you guys are manifesting them. And again, I really like thinking differently, right? Like taking it modular, simplifying it. ‘Cause you know, I had lots of conversations. Two things you’ve hit on that have been problematic for companies with me. One is speed? Speed is, I’m so curious if you’re all still willing to run your modular technology at 30 or 40 miles an hour.
Vic
I mean the MFL has physical limitations,
Rhett
That’s true, but the Cal, the DEF IMU doesn’t.
Vic
Yeah, it doesn’t. And the sampling rates are high enough, it’s just a matter of making sure the tool would stand and the time constant on the springs not handle it. I mean, there’s definitely more wear and tear on the tools as you run faster.
Rhett
But But I’ve hit on that –
Chirs
Speed isn’t gonna be that big of an issue.
Rhett
No, it is for some people though that it is for some people that need to run Repeatable inspections after certain threats. There’s a there’s a market for that And then the second thing is the operators being able to run it.So I’ve heard a lot of operators complain like hey Look if you want to run a tool, it’s expensive We got to get the whole cruise out there and you’re you’re chipping away at that which is in it in a way that is efficient like not not chipping away on key things but you can give the operator the ability to take your tool put it in the pipe themselves I mean that’s –
Chris
Efficient
Rhett
it’s just efficient it’s good I really like what I’m hearing where are you guys going now what’s on the forefront
Vic
so the you know getting the MFL commercialized I think this is gonna be a very big thing so some of the reasons so you asked why we put you know what’s the idea behind the MFL to The MFL tool, obviously, the obvious being an extension to what we’re doing, the other important thing is by shrinking it, for our benefit is one, but you’ve got to look at it from a customer’s perspective. You don’t need to do any more trap modifications.
Rhett
Oh, yes.
Chris
And that’s something in itself as well, right?
Rhett
I know. This is… Yeah.
Chris
It’s fantastic.
Vic
And then from 12 -inch and now we’re shooting for a single section. So…
Rhett
A – 12 inch tool, single body.
Vic
Single body 12 inch. So.
Chris
So for others, what that means is that 12 inch up, it would ideally be single body in many cases. Yeah, it’s fantastic.
Vic
Yes, we’re at this point in time we’re only planning to go up to 12.
Chris
Okay.
Rhett
Oh, I was going to ask if we’re going to come up with like a 48 inch tool and then it’s going to be a 48 single body.
Chris
I’m going to change direction a little bit. So talk to us a little bit and we appreciate you. We’ll keep you here all day if we don’t stop at some point. Are you guys manufacturing these tools? Are y ‘all building your own tools or are you outsourcing that?
Vic
No, we are. We build our tools. We design. Everything is done in -house.
Chris
So that means if you’re an operator and you need something, you’re able to take care of them?
Vic
Absolutely. Yes, sir. Yes. This tool is funny. This tool was not a tool that—
Rhett
Was built right for the show? Im just kidding
Vic
Yes, you know, not our show, not our kind of show, it’s kind of show. I mean, the customer called and said they wanted it too. I mean, we have, you wouldn’t believe it, that the crisis creates so many opportunities to come up with something new.
You know, without naming, you know, people, but you know, you run a four inch line and you realize they have a miter in the four inch. What are you gonna do? Build a three inch, put a four inch gap. And it’s a non -stop process.
Chris
Don’t let a good crisis go to waste. Yeah, exactly. It’s an opportunity.
Rhett
You’re so political.
Vic
I’m speaking from an engineering passion’s standpoint.
Chris
We need to cut this off.
Vic
I’m just messing with you guys, but seriously, that’s how we have been able to come up with with new tools with with cutting edge, you know, out -of -the -box tools every single time because a certain pipeline would give you that challenge to, the motivation to go figure it out.
Rhett
Vic, you bring so much passion to the table. This has been a lot of fun. So if you’re one of our guests, one of our listeners, you really need to give EnviroCal a look, go see their booth, check out the pig in the box. Maybe one day you sign up for EnviroCal Prime. Thank you, Rhett. We’ll see, but hey, before we let our listeners go, you’re so passionate about tools. What do you do when you’re not building tools?
Vic
– I, uh -huh.
Rhett
Don’t tell me all you do is build tools.
Vic
I like to fly.
Rhett
You’re a pilot?
Vic
Yes, sir. Yes.
Rhett
Oh, fantastic. So, hence the, the you said earlier that there’s a lot of similarities between…
Vic
Everything is interconnected in some fashion.
Rhett
Yeah. How long did you pilot’s license?
Vic
About four years now.
Rhett
Oh, fantastic.
Chris
And, and you, we’re working on MFL to all at the same time. That’s awesome.
Vic
It’s all part of the plan, though.
Rhett
So you’re going to fly over the lines too and do right -of -way inspections?
Vic
I can test the shipping methodology myself.
Rhett
Are you just going to drop it off? It’s like a parachute. Do you just drop it off and it parachutes down?
Vic
Actually, my plane is actually SR -22. It does have a parachute, by the way, for the entire airframe.
Chris
So my wife doesn’t know that. I’ve talked to my wife multiple times. I’ve mentioned it. So we live by Hooks Airport in Alright, and we drive by it all the time and I legit tomorrow if I was like, you know, maybe a lot of these planes are cheaper than Mercedes So I think we need to buy a plane and she doesn’t even answer anymore. She just keeps on like, you know, they have a parachute, right? I’ll give you another you know her uncle Had one of those and it about three years ago it parachuted into someone’s front lawn if you Google that in Houston That was the her uncle. But anyways,
Vic
Yeah, they work great, you know, You know, I
Rhett
You’ve tested a parachute. Nope. This is where we have to wrap it up I may need a partner at some point in time if he learns how to start flying because if he flies like he drives I am definitely in trouble. Vic I want to thank you for joining us to all of our guests. Hopefully you enjoyed it and we have See you again. Hopefully next year’s PPIM and thanks for joining us